Ep.2 - This Probably Isn't Anything so What am I Even Doing?

Listen to full episode :

Paul meets with two former Silver Chain members: Janet, the first woman to win The Silver Chain's coveted Personality of the Year award, and Diana, who is frequently featured in the newsletters for her dancing and wardrobe. 

A darker side to this group emerges, where women often joined at the request or demand of their husbands, and Paul learns that both Janet and Diana complied in an effort to keep their marriages intact.

Episode 2 Transcript

A QUICK WARNING: THIS EPISODE CONTAINS MATERIAL NOT SUITABLE FOR CHILDREN

When I arrive in Modesto, Carol is still in the ICU. And she’s doing better and breathing without the aid of a respirator. But even if Carol wants to talk, she’s unable to. 

Kimmer: As of today, she does not have a voice.

Paul: Oh. From the.

Kimmer:  Yeah.

That’s Kimmer. Carol’s daughter. We meet in the office of Kimmer’s graphic design and printing business. It’s nestled in a sleepy old strip mall with a pie shop that’s open three hours a day, four days a week. Kimmer’s space is clean and organized with lively examples of her print work all over her walls. Like Open House fliers. And ads for local restaurants.

I bring with me a three ring binder of printed out PDFs of The Silver Chain’s newsletters, hoping to discuss Carol’s many contributions.

Paul: These are all articles that either your mom or dad wrote. 

Kimmer: So these are okay. So Carol P…

Kimmer: I wonder how they set this, you know? 

Paul:  Yeah, I don't know. There's a lot of different fonts. 

Kimmer: To Right, and I'm like, Well, that doesn't make sense because. Because that was before computers. 

And then they folded them and put them in an envelope. Wow. Just. Wow. 

So you've had fun reading all this crap? 

Paul: Yeah. 

In case you haven’t noticed, Kimmer has a gruff sense of humor. But that softens when we discuss her mom.

Kimmer : I would really, really love Mom to come out of what she's in. And and actually come back to life. 

Paul: Yeah. 

Kimmer: I think that this proves that she's got a lot to offer.

Paul: It really does. 

Kimmer: It really does. Beyond the male myth discussed by New Horizons. 

Paul: That's your mom. 

Kimmer: Yep. I'm really hoping that, uh. She chooses to live. So far she's not.

Paul: Do you want to give her this? 

Kimmer: Do you really want to give it to me? To give to her?  It would be fun to talk to her about it. 

I’m Paul Ditty, and this is Time Capsule: The Silver Chain

So I leave Kimmer with my binder of newsletters, and – I have to tell you – I feel like I’m missing something on my flight home. 

And it’s because at this point these newsletters have been by my side for months. It’s weird not having them. But if this archive of a part of Carol’s life sparks something in her, totally worth it.

However, I’m also at a point with Carol where all I can do is wait. So I make more phone calls. And for the most part it’s more of the same:

And then it happens. Two former Silver Chain members are STILL ALIVE AND! Are willing to speak. Both of them still live in the Twin Cities, which is one of my favorite places to visit. 

It totally brings me back to my childhood, when traveling from small-town Bemidji to the Minneapolis/St. Paul area to see my Grandma Trudy was the closest I got to the cosmopolitan life all my favorite tv shows depicted. Grandma Trudy lived in Richfield, a suburb just west of Bloomington, home of The Silver Chain. 

She was fabulous. She was glamorous. She was a real-life Mary Richards. A queewn of crafts. A garage-saler. The first woman in Bemidji to get a divorce and then get the hell out of town to start over in the big city. Or, a suburb next to the big city. Same thing when you’re a small-town kid. 

Grandma Trudy died in 2015, but if she were still alive, she’d be the same age as the women I’m going to meet. 

Our first interview is with Helen, a woman who makes regular appearances in the newsletters. She’s even featured as a personality of the month, where she’s profiled as a mother of two who enjoys camping, sunbathing, and, occasionally, her husband. 

Today Helen is no longer able to enjoy her husband even on occasion because she’s widowed. And during our many phone conversations before the interview trip, Helen is sure to tell me what a Good Christian Woman she is. So this should make our conversation about The Silver Chain interesting to say the least.  c

The night before we are to meet in person, I review questions with my producers, Nora and Jeyca. And then call Helen  to both confirm the interview time and see what I can bring for lunch. 

The next day, as I’m waiting on our lunch order at the deli, I get a text from Nora.

(Text Message Sound Effect)

Nora: Helen isn’t coming to the door. You don’t think she’s ditching us do you?

Paul: I can't imagine her doing that. Hold on. Let me give her a call. 

Helen does eventually answer her phone, and then, the door. 

Helen seems older than she did on the phone, and surprised to see us, even though we’d talked the day before. She puts in her hearing aids, and sets our chicken parmesan sandwiches on her finest china while Nora and Jeyca set up the recording equipment. 

A calendar beside her phone has “Lunch with Paul” written in cursive on the day we’re meeting. It’s the only appointment for the entire month.

And at first, the conversation seems fine.

Audrey: Elio? It did a lot of dancing. He. He loved to dance. I loved to dance. And though li it was it it was he he was a he was a good dancer. And he could he– Oh, he is. He could. He could dance like you would believe. Yeah, it was fun. 

But once we begin to talk about The Silver Chain, things unravel quickly. It’s evident that Helen is suffering from memory loss. The only time any light flickers in her eyes is when I share copies of The Silver Chain’s newsletters. I think maybe we are onto something until she says:

Audrey: So you got into that Silver Chain too.

So no. This is not an interview we can do, at least not for the podcast. We cut the recording, and just sit and visit for the next half hour. We talk about the neighborhood, her kids, and before we leave, we take care of the dishes overflowing from her sink to the stove.

And when we leave Helen’s, I feel sad and pretty fucking gross. 

The conversations Helen and I had on the phone were short enough for her to put up a good front. But in person, it’s clear that Helen shouldn’t be living on her own. And that a total stranger shouldn’t be buying her lunch and asking about  her swinging past. 

And yes, I knew that the people I’d be interviewing were in their eighties. But in the years since my grandmother died, I guess I’ve forgotten how brutal and lonely it can be to age. 

This has me super apprehensive about my interview with Diana the following day. I’m thinking “Can I even do this?” Well, I’m already here, so don’t I kind of have to?

The first time I read about Diana is in a January 1977 newsletter recapping the club’s third anniversary dance. It’s the Saturday of Super Bowl weekend and the temperature in the Twin Cities is 32 degrees below zero. But even that doesn’t stop 90 couples from arriving at The Thunderbird Motel to attend the soiree of the year.

That night, Diana and her husband Chuck are awarded a magnum of champagne for attending every dance in 1976.

Chuck’s a photographer by hobby and snaps pictures throughout the night for upcoming newsletters.

Diana is known for her dancing. And her outfits. In one newsletter, there’s a photo of her entertaining the crowd at a Silver Chain party with a belly dance.

In the photo, Diana is on the dancefloor in a beaded bedlah on her knees, back arched and arms stretched out for the show stopping performance. It’s an image of someone in total control, aware of their talent, looks. Someone who appears, in that moment, to be completely fearless.

Diana: Okay. I have a picture of me in this beautiful red dress. Pretty sexy. 

Paul: I read in the newsletters, I'll share them with you. But there are multiple times where, you know, they're describing your outfit. 

Diana: Really? 

Paul: Yeah. In. In detail. 

Diana: Oh, my goodness. 

It’s a gorgeous sunny day  when Nora, Jeyca and I meet Diana in her lakeside townhome in suburban St. Paul. Even though I’m still pretty gutted from my meeting with Helen, after reading all about Diana in the newsletters, I can’t help but be excited to meet her. Once again, I have a long list of questions, and I’m hoping Diana will have the tea. But instead she serves Country Time Lemonade. 

And this is fitting because Diana’s place – it’s a Grandmother’s dream home.

Diana: I kind of like, you know, the old fashioned early American styles and stuff. 

If I were a real estate agent selling this home, I’d rave about the large windows and breathtaking lake views. The cozy wall to wall blue carpeting. And the super cute wallpaper border of geese wearing bonnets. 

And during the Open House, I’d pitch the home as an artist’s lakeside hideaway because on every wall, in every corner there are paintings: of waterfalls, birch groves, swans and daffodils. All created by Diana herself.

Diana:  I've done crocheting, embroidery, needle felting, and I paint either by oil or by acrylics. Now I've learned I start with acrylics now because they dry quicker so I can get the background in and then I can work on top of that, which makes for a quicker painting. 

This feels safe, comfortable, and more like what I imagined the setting for my interviews to be. A cat passes in and out of the living room as Diana settles into a Lazy Boy recliner. Despite my long list of questions,  Diana’s story needs no prompting. We’ve barely hit record as she tells me all about how she first met Chuck.

Diana: I had worked at 3M, and so I was in the chorus. The women's chorus in the women's chorus in the men's chorus was separate. But then we would sing together at holidays in the spring. And so I said, Oh, I'll talk to him talking to this just Chuck. And he seemed nice and he talked and so forth. And it was just somebody to kind of talk to, but. Being naive. On the rebound. We ended up together.

Like Helen, Diana is also in her eighties, and from a generation where a majority of women lived with their parents until they fell in love and got married. Or in Diana’s case…

Diana: I married him because I was pregnant and I had to marry him. 

And that's why because I never really loved him. I didn't know love that was. I liked him. 

I had my first baby and we were renting a place. And he said, Gee, I wish I could afford to have a drink any time I wanted to. You know, and here I am, you know, about 22 years old. That was the first clue. And so as the years goes on, this drinking worse. 

The marriage was controlling. He was controlling. He controlled the money. And I had to ask for money to buy this or that or the other thing. And so that was that was part of one of the things that just drove me crazy. So it was controlling and being a dependent person. You go along with the flow and you don't think too much of it until things start getting bad and you start standing up for yourself. 

When I had my second child. The drinking progressed to abuse. And there was emotional abuse. And he. He took a swing at me. One time downstairs. And then he took another. So I. Called the police. And he went and made himself a drink and sat on the deck. Of course they wouldn't do anything. I was course I was afraid, like most women are, to press charges for fear that it would escalate into something even more so. But after they had caught him, they talked to him any other time they he came at me. I he like this. I said, you just go right ahead because you'll be in. I'll have you in jail faster than you can turn around because I will call the cops and I will press charges. And he never dared to hit me again. 

Paul: How did you feel after asserting yourself that way? 

Diana: I felt good. I felt strong. You know, I feel okay. I can stand up for myself. I never thought I could, but, yeah, I felt good. 

Once again, this is not what I expected. I really want to ask Diana my list of questions. And for those of you waiting to hear all the sordid details of how the swinging lifestyle worked, for now you’re going to have to use your imagination because at what point do you interject when someone is telling you something more personal and intimate than any story about swinging.

But finally, after a lot of conversation, I approach the real reason for my visit. 

Paul: How did you first hear about the silver chain? 

Diana: Oh, I honestly do not know. Chuck probably heard about it through somebody. And I know Dorothea was in the chorus at the same time I was in. I don't know if it was through them or. You know, or somebody else. 

I just remember that this was something he wanted to do and it was a social life. 

You know, that's when things started rolling down the hill. 

—

So from the newsletters it looks like Diana is having the time of her life in The Silver Chain. She’s getting awards for being the best dancer, she’s getting recognized for all of her artistic talents. And she’s written up practically monthly for those fabulous outfits. Most of which she made herself. 

Diana: I enjoyed being in the social group, especially when we, you know, went to dance parties and stuff like that. I enjoyed being around other people. I always enjoyed being around people, which I think helped. Just you know it's the intimate thing that bothered me, but otherwise I enjoyed being with the group. They were a pleasant group to be with and and, you know, liked getting out and doing things like that. And know they liked me. Belly dance and all that sort of jazz. 

It was just the the home parties. I did not want to participate in. 

Paul: What what do you what are the– 

Diana: Parties or parties or when The swinging took place.

Paul: I mean, like you when you go to these dances, there's definitely, you know, you're. 

Diana: You're free and you're at. Yeah. And, you know, you're not committed to doing anything right. You know, you're just having a good time, your-- and laughin and dancing and whatever or drink-- whatever you doing. But like you say, when you walk into a home, you know what's expected. And... I was not real comfortable with that. 

But there would be only maybe one or two people that I would even allow to get close to me. Or to do. I’m 

It was just expected. I was expected to go with him. And and so I was expected to participate. But I would just be maybe one person. 

Paul: Did you feel like there were like emotional or personal connections with any of the people you met? 

Diana: Oh, the men. 

Paul:  Yeah. 

Diana: No. No personal connections. I mean, I may have liked them, but I just kind of did it because it was expected of me. And I only did it with an individual that I liked. But I, you know, I didn't lose any of the guys, but. Okay, I like so-and-so. Well, do us. But I had no feeling for them.

Paul: Right. What was Chuck's mood like attending the parties? 

Diana: Oh. I don't know. I guess he liked it. I mean, that's why he wanted to go. You know, but he. I don't know. Maybe he felt that I didn't give him enough or something. He needed more. 

He wanted me to make the phone calls, invite people over. He didn't want to do it. He didn't want to call anybody. He didn't want to do it. So you do it. Sometimes he would invite people over. And the kids were there. 

Paul: To your house. 

Diana: Yes. And I didn't want you know, we would be downstairs. But, you know, kids were there and I did not was not happy with that.

Surprise Surprise. Swinging did not save Diana from an abusive marriage. And as much as I want to imagine Diana swooping down the staircase in a designer gown and flinging divorce papers at Chuck, that is not how it goes down. Instead it’s Christmas 1978. Diana’s making cinnamon rolls, Rockin’ Around the Christmas tree is playing in the background and it’s Chuck serving Diana the papers.

Paul: Were there people in the room? 

Diana: My folks were. Yeah. Everybody was in the room. It was Christmas. 

Everybody. Including Diana and Chuck’s sons. 

1979 rolls around. Chuck moves out, and it’s just Diana and her boys. For the first time in Diana’s life she’s not living under the roof of her parents or husband. She’s forging a life all her own just like Grandma Trudy did only a few years earlier. Only as a kid, I never considered the consequences or the challenges.

Paul: When did you have your first checking account? 

Diana: Uh. Let's see. Probably after the divorce. Because I had to get my money from him. He gave me so much each week, so I don't think I had my own checking. So when I had got divorced, I had to have a checking account and that's probably when I opened one up. 

After all that time being in an unhappy marriage, Diana’s primary focus the following years is on raising her boys. A relationship is the last thing on her mind. Until both sons move out of the house and Diana once again finds herself joining  – a social club. Only this time it’s a singles group at her church.

Diana: Which was kind of fun because they had a fellow who would teach us like dancing, ballroom dancing, you know, and then we'd go to Withrow and have a good time. That's great. Fridays. And so then I said, Well, maybe there's something I can do to kind of pay back. So I asked you guys, what about the newsletter? Can I help you out? 

I was putting the labels on this little newsletter, you know, and I see George's name pop up and I thought, Oh, could that be the same George I knew in high school who I had dated, you know? And so I went. And of course, we have the old fashioned phone book. 

And I looked it up and looked, and there was only one George in all of Mahtomedi and White Bear. So anyway, took me three days to get up the courage that tell myself it's the nineties, I can do this. 

Yes, Diana, you can do this. As one would expect from any woman of the nineties, Diana channels her inner Amanda Woodward and makes the call. She and George reunite at Chili’s. They get baby backs. And Diana gets her baby back.

Diana: The feeling that I felt for George. It was just I couldn't believe I ah, who knows what, you know what love really is, but and maybe not other somebody else may not do the same thing, but it was just a sensation in my body, in my mind. That I really love. This guy. 

Paul: Was wonderful. 

Diana: And so and that was after a couple of weeks away at 18 months. I can't wait. I'm getting older. You know, I got to ask this guy to marry me. So that's why I asked him to marry me. 

Guess what. George totally says yes! The two marry, buy the townhome we’re sitting in right now, and travel the world. For twenty five years, this is their life. And I mean let’s face it – if anyone deserves happiness, it’s Diana. 

Diana: I lost my husband. In 2015, seven years ago, and I'm not signing up any dating apps now, but I would love to meet someone to just go to the theater with, take a day, trip out someplace, you know, drive down the road for a day trip or that kind of thing, you know, just to. Just to hang out with male or female. Actually. Would be fun. That's why these groups are so important to me.

By these groups, Diana is talking about social clubs. Because the one thing that Diana has always loved – even back in her days in The Silver Chain – is the opportunity to connect and meet others. 

Diana: So we have wait have the Red Hat group. And we used to have a big group that get together once a month for lunch. Well, now COVID hit. So there's just nine or ten of us that this during the summer we would get together and eat in the park.

Diana’s energy, her zest for both life and crafting, it’s like a visit with Grandma Trudy. It makes me realize not only how much I miss her but also how incredibly bold she was to make the choices she did. And here in Diana’s cozy home, it’s almost like there’s a part of Grandma Trudy that’s still alive.

There’s something about Diana that draws Nora and Jeyca in as well. Even when the discussion about the Silver Chain ends, they don’t want to leave either. Which is why when Diana offers a tour of her basement art studio, we eagerly accept – 

Diana: Yeah, I guess it's a real disaster down here. You've been down for a while, and I have no place to put my keys. 

Paul: It's nice and cool down here? Do you want me to help at all? 

Diana: See? 

Paul:  Do you want to lift some of these? Okay. 

All of these paintings have price tags on them. Everything’s for sale. Between myself, and Nora and Jeyca, we all want to splurge on Diana’s crafts. But Diana doesn’t take Venmo. So we settle on the adorable felt animals residing on her dining room table.

Nora: And you want it that we both want to. I want a little chipmunk. Paul's going to buy it for me because he's buying. 

Yeah, he's bankrolling this. 

Paul: I have $50. Okay. This is 55. Yeah. 

Nora: We have to come back. We're going to come back. 

Diana: Oh, yeah. All right. 

Paul: Sorry. Diana. You’re not rid of us. Oh. 

Diana: Well, that's okay. 

Diana walks us out, a new pep in her step. Likely because she just got fifty bucks out of me.  And honestly, I don’t feel like this interview would be complete without a proper Minnesota goodbye.  

And for those of you who aren’t in the know. A Minnesota Goodbye involves a walk out to the car, continuing the conversation, maybe even getting into the car and rolling down the window so you can talk some more.

It’s a long running joke for a lot of Minnesotans. But what I’ve found in most cases,it’s the goodbye where the most meaningful conversation happens. 

Diana: I didn't expect to tell my whole life story about my–my ex and my husband and all the sort of jazz and how I grew up. Well, you know, that's probably some of that I wouldn't mind having the kids know about. 

Paul: Yeah. 

Diana: How mom went from dependent to a strong woman.

(PHONE RING)

Nora: Oh, hi. 

Paul: Hey, hey. 

Nora: Diana's so sweet. 

Paul: She totally is so sweet. 

Nora: That was such a good conversation. I'm worried. 

Like, I don't know. Based on yesterday and today. I don't know that we have enough.

Paul: These two women were the ones that I was banking on to either. Um, open this story up for us. Aw, yeah. To be able to form a connection or a relationship with them where they felt comfortable enough to potentially introduce me to other people that might be willing to talk.

Nora: And, yeah. 

Paul: That's not the case with either of them.

Nora: No. 

Paul: I also feel horrible for Diana. Like. I mean, I feel like we just met this woman. That's really wonderful. And, you know, she's alone. Like, she has trouble finding friends. She, you know, it's like she can't get anyone to do an art exhibit for her. And I just want to know. I just want to, like, I want to do everything for her. And that's not related to the silver chain. It's just, here's this woman that, you know, obviously, your humanity.

Nora : Yeah. Which is I know, I know, she's like a lovely person, an interesting person, but. 

Paul : It's.

Nora: Not.

where it stands now, we don't have enough to commit to making a podcast about this. Yeah. 

Paul: Oh, man. 

Nora: Uh. I'm sorry.

Paul: Yeah. Same. 

Can you hear my disappointment in that moment. It is excruciating  for me to consider that this isn’t enough for me to go on. But I can’t force a story that at this point doesn’t exist. Or that time has erased.

Diana: Maybe that part of my life is something I. I don't care if I remember it. And maybe that's part of it. I, you know, it's process part of my life that I'm not. Real proud of. 

So I’m driving and a block from my hotel, just across the street from Minnesota’s only IKEA, is a massive empty plot of land with freshly mowed grass. The only clue as to what it once was is the street sign attached to the stop light. A sign that says Thunderbird Road.

This is where it all happened, that magical arctic winter night in 1977. But here I am, looking at the empty space and hoping something will spring to life. Kind of the same way I’m doing with the newsletters. And after speaking with Diana I’m realizing the story might not be even close to what I imagined it to be.

But even though it’s not what I imagined it to be, isn’t it still worth telling?

—-

The night after I meet Diana, I continue grappling with the idea that the story I wanted and expected to hear might not exist. And that If I choose to continue on this search, I have to be prepared to tell a story where I – a fiction writer – have zero control of the narrative.

And that’s assuming that anyone else will actually talk to me. From my hotel, I attempt to reach other former members in the area with zero luck.

Until I reach a guy we’re going to call Bill.

Harold: It took me a few minutes to figure that that was connected with their swinging. It took me a few minutes because, like I said, I never specifically knew about something called Silver Chain until… Until your call. 

Paul: Right. 

Harold: But then I could easily connect when you told me about the dances and that I could easily connect it up with, you know– with that part of their lives. So I didn't know If you knew That they were swingers and you didn't know if I knew. So I know we had to kind of like gingerly– 

Paul: It was a little bit of a dance of its own.

I call Bill in the hopes of tracking down his mother, Janet. In 1974, Janet was the very first Silver Chain’s personality of the year. A newsletter commemorating the honor captures Janet seated in a wicker peacock chair, with dark wavy hair cascading down her shoulders and bright eyes, that even in an old pixelated photo, remain electric.

I feel like Bill and I click instantly. It’s nice to talk with someone who understands why I’m so interested in this group. Bill even agrees to facilitate an online interview with Janet, who now lives in Florida. You’ll hear Bill laughing or commenting in the background on occasion, helping his 84 year old mom – who’s hard of hearing – navigate my questions.

Janet begins her story in 1957 at the University of Minnesota. 

Jaci: He said, the only reason you want to go to college is to find a husband. And I said, You're right. I said, I want a college educated husband. So. And I said, because ultimately I want college educated kids, you know, and I want to make sure that I'm up to it. So I always worked in and I always had a job, sometimes two or three, and made my way through college. And how I met my husband, actually, like the first day I went to college in a anthropology class. 

He just seemed very friendly. And we got to talking. It was a big class, big auditorium.

I had already had several other guys I dated, ask me if I wanted to marry them. And I said, no, I'm not ready to get married. And finally but my husband never asked. And I finally said, If you don't ask me to marry you pretty soon go away. 

You know, typical college life. Men falling all over you with marriage proposals. 

Soon after marrying, Hal joins the military and the two of them move from Minnesota to Texas to Alaska. The plan is to return to Minnesota where Janet will put her psychology degree to work, and the two of them will buy their first house.  

Jaci: My father in law and husband were supposed to go out looking for a house, but instead they went out looking at apartment buildings and they decided that we should buy an apartment building instead   

So instead of being a psychologist or working in a business or you know, and I guess I used to running the building, my college education. And it turned out our place was called. Well, they had a name, but everybody always referred to it as Widows Manor, because that's all we had, primarily as widows in the building. 

And then I got pregnant and we were, I thought, doing fine.  I had learned how to rent apartments and I learned how to take care of doing the books. 

So everything’s coming up roses for Janet. She’s running things. That idyllic suburban life? Janet’s got her own version of it. Until one day, when Hal gets reacquainted with an old friend.

Jaci: And then we went to his house and I thought this was a strange kind of party because it seemed like some of the people were disappearing. And so they'd come back a little later and they were going upstairs, you know, and I said, Oh, maybe they're just going upstairs to neck or, you know, who knows? Well, actually, they and unbeknownst to me, they were, I guess, what are now known as swingers. 

Janet doesn’t think much of it. It’s definitely not her cup of tea. And besides, she has other plans for her life, like raising her son, collecting rent from widows, even thinking about maybe having another baby. 

And Hal - well he does what many married men with kids do in the prime of their lives – at least in the 1970s –  he starts a poker night with a group of his friends.

Jaci: And so they were playing that on a regular basis. And then one night something happened at the apartment building that I needed Hal's info on in order to. Take care of the problem because his mom and dad weren't around either. 

Anyway, so I called where he was supposed to be playing poker and Charlie says, Oh, well, we haven't played poker for about four weeks. And I said, Oh, really? I said, He wasn't telling me. 

And so I went over to this friend's house where I knew they had these parties. And I asked them. It was kind of late, though, because it was close to midnight and there wasn't any parties going on. But I rang the doorbell and I said to him, Have you seen Hal? I said, I know you must have, because I'm pretty sure that was his car I see out here. And he says, Yeah, he's here. And I says, I need to talk to him. And  he says, He's with someone. I said, I'm pretty sure he is. And I went upstairs and I where he was in bed with some other woman and that pretty much did me in. 

After Janet finds Hal in bed with another woman, she’s pissed. She goes back to the apartment, packs a suitcase and leaves with Billy.

Jaci: I disappeared from him and his family for oh I know, about a week or more. And finally his mom and dad said, What the heck is going on? And he says, I don't know. She's mad about something. 

Paul: Something. 

Jaci: Yeah, something… So I went back and we went to. Marriage counselor, I guess you'd call it an. The actually, he was no help at all. He just said, you'll have to work this problem out yourself. 

And Hal had told me after we saw the counselor were that that. He wasn't going to stop seeing other women occasionally. And I said, okay, well, maybe I'll find somebody too… 

I was walking at the mall and this guy, two guys were coming down the road and they stopped and they talked to me for a little bit. And then one guy says, I really like you. I'd like to get to know you better. Can I have your phone number? So I'm giving it to them. Now this is in the time of mini skirts and high boots and long hair. And that's what I looked like. Miniskirts, high boots, long, long hair. And with my little son. And the guy says, okay, oh, I'll give you a call. So he called and we got together and we started having a relationship.

The guy was very handsome, looked a lot like Robert Redford.

Robert Redford. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid-era Redford. Is there a more ultimate 1970s thirst trap? Not for Janet. In a matter of weeks, she tells Hal all about her new beau. 

Jaci: He said, I'd like to meet him. And. I said, Well, I don't know if he'll do that. I said, I don't think his wife has any idea who's coming over here, and he wouldn't want it to be known. But anyway, eventually I did. He did meet my husband, and after that, my husband decided that maybe he didn't need to see other women separately.

Oh that Janet, turning the tables on Hal. It sounds like Hal realized OH. It doesn’t feel so good to find out that your spouse is having an affair with some stranger. Who looks like – did I mention – Robert Redford. A man who literally picked up your wife at the mall while she was hanging out with your son. Is this where Hal commits to monogamy?

No Hal gets this other idea. He proposes that they see other people together by doing the thing Janet wasn’t initially interested in, in the first place: swinging. 

You see, to Hal, swinging is not cheating – they will always know what the other is up to – and finally Janet agrees to it. Hal picks up a swingers magazine from a newsstand and finds the nearest swinging group listed – in Chicago, six hours away.

These drives – especially in the winter – get old real fast. Eventually Hal spots an ad for a local group that’s just getting their start.

Jaci: And I think they were advertising Silver Chain in there. 

It’s late 1973, the beginning of The Silver Chain, when Janet and Hal join.

Jaci: You know, they were nice people. And that we found that there were some that we got along with really well. And. Actually even something like the silver chain, you form cliques. And you have a group of friends that you party with. And that's what we did. Yeah, we had a sort of the standard group that we partied with for years. 

Since our family now included two kids. We put two apartments together and the kids would sleep in one side and we could have the party on the other side for a while. And then then it got. So that didn't work too well because all we decided we wanted even more room. So we built a penthouse… And that had like five bedrooms. And it was very good for partying. 

Paul: On top of the apartment building. You built a penthouse? 

Jaci: Yes. We took over the party room and just expanded it and the original builder of the apartment building did it for us, but it had beam ceiling. I mean, it was a gorgeous place. 

Okay, this is my ultimate fantasy. Janet and Hal are basically living like rich soap opera characters. With one small addition: a soundproof wall that divides the kids area from the adult side.

Paul: And when you would have the parties at your penthouse. How many couples would you invite? 

Jaci: Well, 20. 30. 

Harold: 30 couples. 

Jaci:  Yeah, we had a New Year's Eve party one time that there were all these strangers coming that I had never even met, that other people said, Oh, we're going to bring some friends with us because they don't really have anything that's going. And I said, not if they don't bring something to pass around in terms of food they aren’t. So everybody brought food too and their own bottle, of course. And I think we had like 80 people, maybe more. I'm not even sure how many there were. 

Paul: And if you were having a party at your house, did you like was was there certain music you played? 

Jaci: We just left the television on. And people can watch whatever they want to. 

Okay, interesting… I definitely did not expect people to be fornicating to Hogan’s Heroes

Paul: It sounds like you assimilated really well into this group, like you were. You were you were open to it. 

Jaci: Well, I didn't you know, I wasn't in the beginning, but I didn't really have any choice. It was if I was going to be married to this guy, this is going to be my life, sort of make the best of it. And I've sort of always been that way, make the best of what you can. You know, you can't always do what you want. But you can try. 

And that's what it was. I did it my way in that sense, you know? I mean, I was swinging. Yes, but my way. 

Hearing Janet talk about The Silver Chain, all these years later, runs an interesting parallel to Diana’s story. At the root of it, this isn’t what she wanted her life to be. But she made it work. 

Is it possible that the other women celebrated in articles of the newsletter weren’t really that into it , either?

It’s a thought that’s hard for me to reconcile, because the newsletters are written predominantly by women. Celebrating each other, giving each other advice. 

Paul: Do you recall receiving the Silver Chain newsletter? 

Jaci: I'm sure we did, but I don't know… I never saved them or anything, so. I don't. I couldn't tell you anything about the Silver Chain newsletter. 

Paul: One of the regular columns in the newsletter is about a group called New Horizons, which was like a discussion group that was led each month by Carol 

Jaci: Oh, yeah. Well, that wasn't something we were very interested in. I think that they felt that it was some some of the people on the committee that started the whole thing thought that this would be a good idea for helping people be more comfortable. I think. But we didn't. We never participated in that. 

Diana’s memory of the newsletter is also fleeting. Even when I show her highlights where she’s mentioned, it’s as if it’s her first time reading the accolades.

And here is where I have to stop telling the story I want to and begin listening to what I’m hearing from those who lived it. 

Because it’s beginning to sound like the newsletter was a framing of sort by a select group of individuals who wanted to make The Silver Chain into something that – at least for the people I’ve talked to so far – it simply wasn’t.

Before I catch my flight back to California, I decide to take a drive by Grandma Trudy’s swanky apartment building. And this grand building that once seemed so magical now has the allure of a three-story state prison. The natural brick exterior is now painted gray and blue in an attempt to modernize. Those vintage swag lamps are now replaced by recessed lighting.

Even if that funky lighting was still in place, the magic would still be gone. Because the woman who made this place so fabulous is also gone. But that doesn’t change my memories. That’s the reason this building - despite its – let’s be honest – shit appearance - still means something to me.

And maybe that’s the reason why someone held onto The Silver Chain’s newsletters, and bothered to take out a safe deposit box for the sole reason of storing them. The newsletters – at least for this one individual – held meaning. 

So despite the real risk of this search goes nowhere, I have to follow my belief that. There’s a story here. So far, not the one I thought I would hear. Probably not something I’m prepared to hear. But this. Is something.

This is why I need to speak to Carol herself. The author of so many of these articles. The woman whose kids helped to print and mail them out. I need to know if the newsletters I left with her daughter Kimmer resonated with Carol in any way. Hours after I return home, I receive a reply.

Paul: And I said, How is your mom doing? And she said, Oh, I thought I messaged you. She passed away. So Carol actually passed away on Friday, the 5th of August. 

She said, I think my mom just really wanted to be back with my dad, and that's ever since he passed away, she just hasn't wanted to live. 

And that’s when I find out that Carol is gone. 

(THEME MUSIC PLAYS)

I’m Paul Ditty and this is Time Capsule: The Silver Chain